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pr126 resident misanthrope

Joined: 03 Jan 2005 Posts: 8464 Local time: 6:48 PM

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Posted: Thu Apr 24, 2008 2:01 pm Post subject: Why faith cannot be personal. |
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Why faith cannot be personal.
Faiths, especially the "desert dogmas" as Pat Condell calls them, are the so called Abrahamic faiths which includes Judaism, Christianity and Islam.
I cannot comment on other faiths, as I know nothing about them.
Judaism can be described as a personal faith as to my best knowledge does not openly proselytise, and becoming a Jew, not borne into Judaism, requires long study and acceptance. (not that anyone in his/her right mind would want to become the most reviled and persecuted people on the planet out of choice). Although I am sure there must be some.
The two other religions, Christianity and Islam does actively recruit new members in an agressive way, Islam even more so.
So this is something that is built into the said religions, and therefore it is impossible to be a personal affair, as it must advertise, proselytise to gain adherents.
I understand that in Islam it was to recruit soldiers for Allah, well for Mohammad really, since the religion was created by a criminally insane warlord specifically for warfare, to loot, to enslave, and to conquer.
What was /is Christianity's drive to proselytise in such an aggressive way? Is it really to "save" souls from eternal damnation or is it something else? I don't think for one moment that altruism is behind all this.
Over to you. Especially to our theist posters.
BTW, I was always an atheist, and never studied any religion seriously.
. _________________ "Orwell was a visionary. He just got the date wrong."
Last edited by pr126 on Thu Apr 24, 2008 2:12 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Mr_C Reckoner

Joined: 26 Jun 2006 Posts: 6546 Local time: 11:48 AM Location: Pale Blue Dot

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Posted: Thu Apr 24, 2008 2:10 pm Post subject: |
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If all these Christians have a "personal relationship" with Jesus, why do they have to be introduced to this concept first?
It seems to me that if Jesus were anything except for imaginary, this relationship would be a universal phenomenon. _________________ "If we long to believe that the stars rise and set for us, that we are the reason there is a Universe, does science do us a disservice in deflating our conceits?"
Carl Sagan
The Atheist Forums Rules
Summary: Just play nice, mmkay? |
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baddogma antitheist

Joined: 01 Feb 2006 Posts: 9233 Local time: 3:48 AM Location: Colorado
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Posted: Thu Apr 24, 2008 2:43 pm Post subject: |
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| Mr_C wrote: | If all these Christians have a "personal relationship" with Jesus, why do they have to be introduced to this concept first?
It seems to me that if Jesus were anything except for imaginary, this relationship would be a universal phenomenon. |
good point! _________________ Join http://www.sefora.org/
Can omnicient god who knows the future find the omnipotence to change his future mind?
I'm ashamed of what I did for a Klondike bar.... |
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aitm using the thinker thingy

Joined: 06 Jan 2008 Posts: 1208 Local time: 1:48 PM Location: Melbourne, Fl

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Posted: Thu Apr 24, 2008 3:07 pm Post subject: |
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The person/people who wrote this crap had a great deal of hope vested in it. They devoted the entire book of Dueteronomy ( if I remember correctly) on how the priests are to be paid. It seems the sons of Aaron had a good deal to gain the more believers there are.
So it seems that this simple idea was agreeable to those who wanted to become priests as a way of making a living. The more followers the more money.
Today it seems to be especially true only not just money but power is a heavy motivator. _________________ Its not that I question so much whether a god created man, but that he would admit it.- Thomas Brumfield
psst, theres a vagina on your bumper!
Knowledge: The cure for religion.
The reality is: The majority of Christians are, because they have never read the Bible, whereas the majority of Atheists are, because they have. tjb |
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Newman Caribbean Theist

Joined: 16 Apr 2008 Posts: 2009 Local time: 1:48 PM Location: San Juan

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Posted: Thu Apr 24, 2008 3:17 pm Post subject: Re: Why faith cannot be personal. |
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| pr126 wrote: | Why faith cannot be personal.
Faiths, especially the "desert dogmas" as Pat Condell calls them, are the so called Abrahamic faiths which includes Judaism, Christianity and Islam.
I cannot comment on other faiths, as I know nothing about them.
Judaism can be described as a personal faith as to my best knowledge does not openly proselytise, and becoming a Jew, not borne into Judaism, requires long study and acceptance. (not that anyone in his/her right mind would want to become the most reviled and persecuted people on the planet out of choice). Although I am sure there must be some.
The two other religions, Christianity and Islam does actively recruit new members in an agressive way, Islam even more so.
So this is something that is built into the said religions, and therefore it is impossible to be a personal affair, as it must advertise, proselytise to gain adherents.
I understand that in Islam it was to recruit soldiers for Allah, well for Mohammad really, since the religion was created by a criminally insane warlord specifically for warfare, to loot, to enslave, and to conquer.
What was /is Christianity's drive to proselytise in such an aggressive way? Is it really to "save" souls from eternal damnation or is it something else? I don't think for one moment that altruism is behind all this.
Over to you. Especially to our theist posters.
BTW, I was always an atheist, and never studied any religion seriously.
. |
yes, at least for my church, yes, its set up as a non-profit, and although ususally a no-profit means HIGH salaries, not the case here, extremely low salaries for what they go through. so in my personal experience the only thing that grows is the outreach to communities from the church, not the pastors not the members. _________________ "Love Life" |
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