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Castaa
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 Posted: Mon Oct 22, 2007 2:30 pm Post subject: Why Atheists are Not Very Bright |
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Why Atheists are Not Very Bright by D'Souza
| Quote: | | The Fallacy of the Enlightenment is the glib assumption that human beings can continually find out more and more until eventually there is nothing more to discover. The Enlightenment Fallacy holds that human reason and science can, in principle, unmask the whole of reality. In his Critique of Pure Reason, Kant showed that this premise is false. In fact, he argued, that human knowledge is constrained not merely by how much reality is out there but also by the limited sensory apparatus of perception we bring to that reality. |
Oh there is more...
http://news.aol.com/newsbloggers/2007/10/19/why-atheists-are-not-very-bright/
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Castaa
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Philosophos
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| Posted: Mon Oct 22, 2007 2:39 pm Post subject: |
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D'souza's a few centuries behind. The late 20th and 21st centuries have brought the scientific realism & antirealism debate to the fore, and IMO realism has won.
What's that about a little knowledge being a dangerous thing?
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spozmo
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| Posted: Mon Oct 22, 2007 3:52 pm Post subject: |
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| Philosophos wrote: | | D'souza's a few centuries behind. The late 20th and 21st centuries have brought the scientific realism & antirealism debate to the fore, and IMO realism has won. |
I'd be interested in reading some of the realist takes on this. I'd say I'm fairly strictly anti-realist at this point. Isn't that one of the basic tenets of the Copenhagen consensus?
Anyhow, his reading of Kant is fairly solid, I'd say, but his attribution to atheists of an assertion of 100% certainty is an old, tired, and well-refuted trick. We've all seen this. It's stupidity itself.
Also, Kant serves best as an argument against theism. As we see from the fact that nearly string of thought that leads out from him (well... two of them... anyhow) end in atheism. Marx and Nietzsche, two of the final results of the two main interpretations of Kant, were both atheists.
Blargh. What a douche. The application of random concepts to the world around us is not in any way justified by Kant's philosophy. This D'Souza is an idiot. I wonder if he even read the Critique. He doesn't site it explicitly. I bet someone told him something someone told them about a guy who heard the name Kant once. Half-assed semi-philosopher. This makes me so mad.
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eximius
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| Posted: Mon Oct 22, 2007 4:04 pm Post subject: |
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Stereotyping at it's purest.
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Noggin
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| Posted: Mon Oct 22, 2007 4:13 pm Post subject: Re: Why Atheists are Not Very Bright |
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| Castaa wrote: | Why Atheists are Not Very Bright by D'Souza
| Quote: | | The Fallacy of the Enlightenment is the glib assumption that human beings can continually find out more and more until eventually there is nothing more to discover. The Enlightenment Fallacy holds that human reason and science can, in principle, unmask the whole of reality. In his Critique of Pure Reason, Kant showed that this premise is false. In fact, he argued, that human knowledge is constrained not merely by how much reality is out there but also by the limited sensory apparatus of perception we bring to that reality. |
Oh there is more...
http://news.aol.com/newsbloggers/2007/10/19/why-atheists-are-not-very-bright/ |
Arguments like these seem to smack of the stolen concept fallacy. How could Kant stand upon "human knowledge is constrained"? How could he know this? Is there some mysterious "sense" or "knowledge" beyond what we know? According to Kant there is "something" beyond our senses.
| from the article wrote: |
Kant argues, the absence of such evidence cannot be used as the evidence for absence. |
But what stops us, as humans, from inserting any wish or whim into that void "absent evidence"? A forceful religion mayhaps? |
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transientangent
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| Posted: Mon Oct 22, 2007 4:22 pm Post subject: |
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And the enlightenment fallacy has what exactly to do with atheism? Atheism does not require a belief that all can be known.
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Philosophos
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| Posted: Mon Oct 22, 2007 6:11 pm Post subject: |
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| spozmo wrote: | | I'd be interested in reading some of the realist takes on this. I'd say I'm fairly strictly anti-realist at this point. |
So was I. Bas van Fraassen convinced me of it back in undergrad. I was an antirealist up until almost a year ago, where reading the likes of Ian Hacking and his "entity realism" started to convince me otherwise. Add "structural realism" on top of it, and that makes me a "pretty-much-realist". I did a show that's in the IG archives, however, arguing from the anti-realist perspective. I still have a lot of respect for the position - and I'm afraid that many atheists are all too keen on jumping to realist conclusions without really understanding the issue.
| Quote: | | Isn't that one of the basic tenets of the Copenhagen consensus? |
To an extent. But it also takes on an objective probability air to it, IMO.
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Knight_of_BAAWA
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| Posted: Mon Oct 22, 2007 6:30 pm Post subject: |
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Dinesh gets destroyed every time he posts. Even some christians can't stand the stupid fucker.
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spozmo
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| Posted: Tue Oct 23, 2007 11:53 am Post subject: |
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| Philosophos wrote: | | spozmo wrote: | | I'd be interested in reading some of the realist takes on this. I'd say I'm fairly strictly anti-realist at this point. |
So was I. Bas van Fraassen convinced me of it back in undergrad. I was an antirealist up until almost a year ago, where reading the likes of Ian Hacking and his "entity realism" started to convince me otherwise. Add "structural realism" on top of it, and that makes me a "pretty-much-realist". |
Thanks. I'll be looking into getting some of the books by these two authors. I have a great bookstore down the street from me that can special order just about anything very efficiently, so I should be reading them within the next couple months. This stuff is all really interesting. I appreciate you pointing me in the direction of these guys.
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rickcopeland648
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| Posted: Tue Oct 23, 2007 12:06 pm Post subject: |
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edit by admin: the following link is NSFW
Philosphos: "Mr. Nice"? The Rick Copeland's ass...
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CET
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| Posted: Wed Nov 07, 2007 5:55 pm Post subject: |
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| transientangent wrote: | | And the enlightenment fallacy has what exactly to do with atheism? Atheism does not require a belief that all can be known. |
It's a red herring.
What? Don't tell me you're surprised. 
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CET
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| Posted: Wed Nov 07, 2007 5:56 pm Post subject: |
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| rickcopeland648 wrote: | | Philosphos: "Mr. Nice"? The Rick Copeland's ass... |
Thanks for labeling your link NSFW. 
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hillbillyatheist
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| Posted: Wed Nov 07, 2007 6:06 pm Post subject: |
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| I fixed his post with a NSFW label. |
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CET
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| Posted: Wed Nov 07, 2007 6:13 pm Post subject: |
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| hillbillyatheist wrote: | | I fixed his post with a NSFW label. |
*Ninja bow*
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