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ShaSha
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 Posted: Fri Jul 27, 2007 8:12 pm Post subject: |
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| Chaoslord2004 wrote: | | ShaSha wrote: | | Purgatory is for the older Catholics who would be considered past the age of innocence and has nothing to do with baptism. |
Purgatory is for people who have committed cardinal sins and have been unrepentant. If one is unrepentant about a mortal sin, they go straight to hell, according to Catholic dogma. |
As I said, I don't want to nitpick over something neither of us believes. I was defining it for the writer who confused it with Limbo. Purgatory as I learned in in my years of Catholic high school is for just about everybody when they die and is for the venial sins. I agree that the mortal sins sent you straight to hell. The few who went straight to heaven were the ones who were generally canonized. |
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Chaoslord2004
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Joined: 29 Aug 2004
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Local time: 4:41 AM
Location: Minnesota
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| Posted: Fri Jul 27, 2007 9:34 pm Post subject: Re: Pastors Struggle with POE. |
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| ShaSha wrote: | It is their life, their beliefs and they have the right to discuss what they want without second guessing by anybody.
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They have the right to believe as they wish, and I have a right to ridicule their beliefs. They believe incoherent nonsense. It would be disingenuous of me not to point this out.
| ShaSha wrote: | | Those people don't need your permission or mine to practice as they see fit. |
This was never at issue. I fail to see why you are importing superfluous information into this dialogue. The issue was never about permission of any kind. Please try and understand the issues we are dealing with. If you need clarification, please ask. The issue is a critique of Christians cherry-picking the Bible.
| ShaSha wrote: | | for someone who is a philosopher, I'm surprised you don't understand that you can't corral people into one common mind set. |
This is irrelevant.
| ShaSha wrote: | | If that were true, then there would be only one philosopher in history. |
You obviously know nothing about Philosophy. Philosophy is about argumentation, which is precisely what I am engaging in. I am making arguments. If you're main criticism is that I am either to hard on theistic belief or that I am making arguments, speak up now so I don't waste anymore of my time.
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An artist sees beauty in a painting. I see beauty in a logical proof.
"All error is due to extraneous factors, reason itself does not err"
~Kurt Gödel |
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CET
The Spiritual Atheist
Joined: 02 Apr 2003
Posts: 12699
Local time: 1:41 AM
Location: SoCal, USA
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| Posted: Mon Jul 30, 2007 12:37 pm Post subject: Re: Pastors Struggle with POE. |
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| rickcopeland648 wrote: | | Chaoslord2004 wrote: | | A while now. I don't sit in the recommended position, for it hurts my legs, but I sit in a comfortable position, close my eyes, clear my mind and concentrate on either my breathing or my own consciousness. I guess I am a Buddhist to an extent, since I accept the four noble truths. |
That's quite interesting. The Rick Copeland used to practice Zen mediatation avidly and even went of seshin. He even had a couple of very interesting realizations while practicing. The he just dropped it. He has had a real itching to take it back up as he looks back at that period and finds that he was most likely much happier in that time. It's very difficult. Much more so than it sounds... It's also very difficult (impossible?) to avoid the trap of trying to intellectualize it... |
I see that The Rick Copeland already practices non-attachment, just by how he refers to himself. 
There are days when my practice is difficult. When I have bad allergies, or have a lack of sleep due to my busy schedule, sitting is the LAST thing on my mind. I will still take a few minutes from time to time though. If I have a stressful episode at work, I'll find a quiet place to sit for 5-10 minutes. Just enough to get a handle on things before I do or say anything I'll regret.
All in all, I've found that practicing first thing in the morning and at a Zendo under the instruction of a good Sensei is very easy. If I have a good night sleep, and my allergies are benign, I am VERY fond of my morning sit. It is an opportunity to take some time to get my head into the right space. Later in the day is more difficult for me, because I am caught up in the "hustle and bustle" of the day, and have little patience for slowing down.
| rickcopeland648 wrote: | | The Rick Copeland finds Zen Buddhism and atheism very compatible... |
*nods*
My practice is Soto Zen, which begins with the premise that we are all already Buddhas, we just don't realize it. We spend so much time and energy being caught up in things that are distracting, and tell us that we are incomplete, when we in fact are complete.
I particularly enjoy this approach, because it forces a strong emphasis on "awakening". You are already exactly the way you want to be, just wake up.
There is a Zen parable of a woman who was very beautiful. So beautiful, that she spent at least an hour a day admiring her reflection.
One day, she looked at her reflection in a mirror, but she did not see her head. She cried out, "Someone has taken my head!" She ran around frantically screaming, crying, and desperately searching for her head.
Some of her friends saw her, took her back to her home, and stayed with her. She cried at them, "We have to find my head, someone has taken it!"
Her friends tied her to a pole so that she could not move, and she was forced to stay still. Eventually she calmed down. Her friends tried explaining to her that her head was still on her shoulders. Eventually she accepted their words, but was not fully convinced. She knew she was being foolish, but she still had not fully accepted it.
Eventually, one of her friends struck her on the side of the head. She cried out, "OW!" After a moment she cried out, "My head, it was there all the time!"
Her friends released her, and she ran through the streets crying out, "My head, I have my head, it wast there all the time!"
For a few moments it was extraordinary and amazing that she had her head, but soon it became normal. It was amazing, and yet it was nothing unusual. The same is true of our Buddha nature.
| rickcopeland648 wrote: | | If you went into you self-imposed IG exile before the Charles Goodman shows Reggie did, you might want to track those two episodes down. The Rick Copeland would be interested in hearing your remarks regarding the Buddhist concept of the self... |
I heard the first one, but I didn't hear second one. It is currently downloading. 
_________________
Namaste,
CET 
The Spiritual Atheist
"Much of the suffering in the world comes from the delusion that we are separate from one another." - Gautama Buddha
"Those who dance are considered insane by those who can't hear the music." - George Carlin |
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Chaoslord2004
Logician
Joined: 29 Aug 2004
Posts: 8411
Local time: 4:41 AM
Location: Minnesota
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| Posted: Mon Jul 30, 2007 3:57 pm Post subject: Re: Pastors Struggle with POE. |
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| CET wrote: | | All in all, I've found that practicing first thing in the morning |
I usually do it in the afternoon/evening. I can't stand to get up to early.
_________________
An artist sees beauty in a painting. I see beauty in a logical proof.
"All error is due to extraneous factors, reason itself does not err"
~Kurt Gödel |
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ShaSha
Moderator
Joined: 21 Oct 2003
Posts: 4228
Local time: 3:41 AM
Location: Minnesota
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| Posted: Mon Jul 30, 2007 11:00 pm Post subject: Re: Pastors Struggle with POE. |
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| Chaoslord2004 wrote: |
You obviously know nothing about Philosophy. Philosophy is about argumentation, which is precisely what I am engaging in. I am making arguments. If you're main criticism is that I am either to hard on theistic belief or that I am making arguments, speak up now so I don't waste anymore of my time. |
I obviously know a lot about Philosophy. I just argued with you  I was pointing out though that your argument that you posted was with yourself because they didn't hear you and even if they did, they have their own arguments |
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